Trigger words: blue collar
Indicator sentences: define blue collar.
Negotiation parts: construction workers, tradesmen (plumbers, electricians, etc.), ironworkers, factory workers, and employees of public works departments all make pretty good wages. That would be one classic definition of "blue collar." relatively few people work in these fields compared to decades past, however, especially factory workers. Service workers in relatively less skilled positions do not generally make great wages, and are often included in other definitions of "blue collar." While professional waiters and waitresses actually can make good money, this is not the case for gas station attendants, fast food workers, grocery store clerks, etc. Jobs you can get without a trade school or college. Or any job that pays $30,000 or less in the midwest, or less than $50,000 in California/NYC etc. I'm talking household income by the way, so basically single parents, or families with a stay at home parent and one wage earner. Or it could be two wage earners making minimum wage. So - Nursing, police, electricians, plumbers, etc - that would generally be considered blue collar - you are excluding? I've worked construction in the past. My supervisor had only a high school diploma and was making well over 50K a year, in a fairly rural area. This was the rule more than the exception. This is absolutely not true of all jobs requiring only a high school education, but to say it's not *possible* to make decent money in a blue collar job is far different from saying it's much more difficult or that it's uncommon. Also, I think your 30K and 50K cutoffs are somewhat circular reasoning. You can't say blue collar wages are too low and then define "blue collar" as an income level. Well unfortunately I can't change the post title. But for purposes of the argument replace blue collar with 30 to 50k depending on cost of living index but that changes the entire nature of your argument. Saying blue collar jobs don't pay enough to raise a family on is a very, *very* different thing from saying that a certain level of income isn't sufficient to raise a family on. As far as I know blue collar is just an adjective. Is there a hard income amount for it posted somewhere? Blue collar *is* an adjective, and it traditionally refers to manual labor. It usually includes trades, which pay better than unskilled labor, but blue collar jobs in general don't pay all that poorly, they're just harder to come by than they were a few decades ago. There isn't a specified income level for blue collar jobs in general, and that's my point. You started out by saying that a certain type of work (blue collar) couldn't support a family, and then changed your position to a certain income level, regardless of the type of work being done. I'm not sure how the type of work is relevant at all to raising a family. Based on the context of the title it should have been clear it was referring to income. I'm sorry if it wasnt. Why? Blue collar does not refer to income but a type of work (manual labor). So why would your title clearly be about income. And if it is clearly about income then the use of the term 'blue collar' implies it is clearly about income of blue collar jobs. Which implies you think the majority of blue collar jobs pay badly. So it was a relevant argument against the post.
Indicator sentences: So your view is that poor people should stop reproducing because they can't afford cell phones? I'm not trying to lampoon you, but that's what I'm getting from your posts and I figure you'd like to clarify that statement.